Hi, while I wait for the new software ( my F-16SGRH is currently not working correctly) I would like to use my Cougar grip instead?
I have plugged it onto the R3 base, but none of the buttons appear operational....and its not showing as a device within DCS
What is the procedure for getting it working? Do I need to install foxy etc? I would have thought that it would simply be detected as a DX device within windows..?
As a secondary question, I would also like to start using the cougar throttle with DCS, I have purchased the TUSBA....what is the installation procedure for this please?
Thanks
using cougar stick with R3
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markturner
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Dragon
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Re: using cougar stick with R3
Dear Mark.
I suposse, do you have some bad installation, so, my suggest is:
Remove the TUSBA and the R3L from the device and printers, then, please remove the R3L usb wire and connect it, to force a reinstallation.
check all its OK, if not, check you grip, or connect the F16SGRH to test the R3L its working properly,
After test all its OK, connect the TUSBA, for the installation, please follow the user manual, all its there.
In other hand, I know you gave the F16SGRH removed from the device and printer, but this only remove the BLE operation, so you can use it, as standard grip in the R3L perfectly, and even as advanced grip, with the 2.02 firmware you have installed in your R3L
Cheers.
I suposse, do you have some bad installation, so, my suggest is:
Remove the TUSBA and the R3L from the device and printers, then, please remove the R3L usb wire and connect it, to force a reinstallation.
check all its OK, if not, check you grip, or connect the F16SGRH to test the R3L its working properly,
After test all its OK, connect the TUSBA, for the installation, please follow the user manual, all its there.
In other hand, I know you gave the F16SGRH removed from the device and printer, but this only remove the BLE operation, so you can use it, as standard grip in the R3L perfectly, and even as advanced grip, with the 2.02 firmware you have installed in your R3L
Cheers.
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markturner
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Re: using cougar stick with R3
Hi Manuel, my current situation is this:
R3 is shown installed in devices and printers. In the HID tool, on the R3 tab page, it shows firmware MJF_FW_3_00_1 installed ( not the 2.02 firmware you mention....) . The R3 appears to be working correctly and is detected properly within DCS.
My F-16 Grip is not shown as installed in devices and printers. In the HID tool, on the F-16 page, it says "firmware unrecognized" . If I try and update the firmware, I select the firmware ( in this case, the latest version I have which is F-16RHFW0001.F16SGRH ) It says "device unreachable and asks me to initiate boot sequence. When I press the instructed button combo, and release, the lights go out and nothing happens..... The grip is not detected within DCS. Thats the grip situation. I see some new firmware is to be shortly released so perhaps I should wait until then. At any rate, I will still need some advice as to how to get the device showing in windows first, as plainly, it wont update until its functioning properly within windows.....So how best to uninstall it and start again, when its not shown as a device? When I unplug the grip from the R3 and plug it into the connector wire, the left LED is blinking, so the stick appears to be stuck in its firmware update state but is unable to update.....
In relation to my original question regarding how to install and use the cougar grip with the R3.......its been a good few years since I owned a cougar and I am not up to speed as to whats involved in getting it installed and working. Do I need to install the full suite of drivers and Foxy etc to get it to work? Will the grip on its own be detected and work as a simple DX device within windows?
Could someone give me some pointers please?
I have not yet got around to installing the Cougar throttle, as I have to repair it first using the a hall sensor upgrade. So I wont be installing or using the TUSBA yet......
By the way, all this un plugging and re connecting is a really tense and tricky process, as its very difficult to see if the pins are correctly aligned before you push it home. It can take me several attempts and a few minutes to do this. As feedback, it would be good if there was a way you could positively locate the pins first, before pushing home. I can see this being an issue as it would be SO easy to break or bend them, especially if you are swapping sticks a lot...for example, I have now got the F-16 stick, the warthog grip and the new TM F-18 grip.......so I would be swapping grips each time I wanted to fly a different jet ( F-16 or F-18)
Thank you
R3 is shown installed in devices and printers. In the HID tool, on the R3 tab page, it shows firmware MJF_FW_3_00_1 installed ( not the 2.02 firmware you mention....) . The R3 appears to be working correctly and is detected properly within DCS.
My F-16 Grip is not shown as installed in devices and printers. In the HID tool, on the F-16 page, it says "firmware unrecognized" . If I try and update the firmware, I select the firmware ( in this case, the latest version I have which is F-16RHFW0001.F16SGRH ) It says "device unreachable and asks me to initiate boot sequence. When I press the instructed button combo, and release, the lights go out and nothing happens..... The grip is not detected within DCS. Thats the grip situation. I see some new firmware is to be shortly released so perhaps I should wait until then. At any rate, I will still need some advice as to how to get the device showing in windows first, as plainly, it wont update until its functioning properly within windows.....So how best to uninstall it and start again, when its not shown as a device? When I unplug the grip from the R3 and plug it into the connector wire, the left LED is blinking, so the stick appears to be stuck in its firmware update state but is unable to update.....
In relation to my original question regarding how to install and use the cougar grip with the R3.......its been a good few years since I owned a cougar and I am not up to speed as to whats involved in getting it installed and working. Do I need to install the full suite of drivers and Foxy etc to get it to work? Will the grip on its own be detected and work as a simple DX device within windows?
Could someone give me some pointers please?
I have not yet got around to installing the Cougar throttle, as I have to repair it first using the a hall sensor upgrade. So I wont be installing or using the TUSBA yet......
By the way, all this un plugging and re connecting is a really tense and tricky process, as its very difficult to see if the pins are correctly aligned before you push it home. It can take me several attempts and a few minutes to do this. As feedback, it would be good if there was a way you could positively locate the pins first, before pushing home. I can see this being an issue as it would be SO easy to break or bend them, especially if you are swapping sticks a lot...for example, I have now got the F-16 stick, the warthog grip and the new TM F-18 grip.......so I would be swapping grips each time I wanted to fly a different jet ( F-16 or F-18)
Thank you
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Dragon
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Re: using cougar stick with R3
HI Mark. thanks a lot for write your problems here.
Reading your post, look like the R3L its perfectly installed. of course you don't have the 2.00,2 firmware in the system, just as we have not released, was only in the beta test team. so its impossible you have it. you must have in the R3L the 3.00.1 version, that its the actual released and work with the F16SGRH installed in the R3L.
SO at this point ALL ITS OK.
About your BLE installation, as you told me, that you prefer until, we release the next firmware and software, use the system in the most simple way, I suggest you remove the F16SGRH device from your computer, and use only the R3L with the F16SGRH as a 64 Dx hid buttons. Of course this dont let you use the keystrokes and all the other things in the F16SGRH, and of course, you can not see the F16sgrh in your device and printers, and also you can not see it in the DCS, just as its disconnected.
SO at this point all continue OK.
What you need to do, its really easy, open your DCS and configure it, with the Dx buttons do you have in the R3L, and also, configure in the RS_HID_DEV_TOOL the 8 slots at your convenience, for every flight necessity, use a hard configuration for precision flight, and soft for easy flight, as I told you, when we were connected. Take the real advantage of the R3L with the F16SGRH, do you have 8 different Flight control, in your hand, and you can select what you need in every moment, with your thumb finger.
So at this point, you only need configure your DCS and your R3L, for this you can use the DCS doc and our documentation for the R3L.
About How its your grip at this moment, as you can see, the Grip its trying to link with your computer, but you following my suggest, dont let connect, because you want have the most simple scenario, What you need to do to connect it, follow the Documentation, and do the same we do several times together, when I got the control of your computer. But I suggest, if configure the DCS DX inputs its a difficult task for you, its better you wait a few days, until the beta test team, finish the testing, and we release the new software, And I suggest you use only the R3L with the F16SGRH inside.
About foxy and the old cougar, I must sure you, configure the Direct X buttons in the DCS its a more simple task, than programming the old cougar. and configure the R3L its more simple than recalibrate the old cougar, But you need read the documentation. once you read and test the system you really understand that its ABSOLUTELY EASY just as you get what you see. with no necessity of programming, or doing any script.
About the plug-in and reconnecting.
Here the point its, that TM put this connector in the first beginning and the only way to let you have compatibility with your old Cougar and the new Warthog it use the same connector, really we dont like this connector, but the other choice, its dont let you use the cougar or warthog in the R3, and this its not what you really like, no? of course you can change grips as many time as you like, and here I really connect grips several times every day, but at home, I had installed my F16SGRh and I dont change it, so at home, its really difficult I will broken the connector, and here in the company, with the testing, of course I take care, and I have not broken any ever. Can be broken, of course, but, the other way its incompatibility
Please, Mark, take a look to the documentation, and please, forgot the idea about use the system its a difficult task, its absolutely easy, and once you do your first configuration, you will be pride and will enjoy it.
And hope in a few days release the new software, and this will let you use near to whole system through the R3L.
Reading your post, look like the R3L its perfectly installed. of course you don't have the 2.00,2 firmware in the system, just as we have not released, was only in the beta test team. so its impossible you have it. you must have in the R3L the 3.00.1 version, that its the actual released and work with the F16SGRH installed in the R3L.
SO at this point ALL ITS OK.
About your BLE installation, as you told me, that you prefer until, we release the next firmware and software, use the system in the most simple way, I suggest you remove the F16SGRH device from your computer, and use only the R3L with the F16SGRH as a 64 Dx hid buttons. Of course this dont let you use the keystrokes and all the other things in the F16SGRH, and of course, you can not see the F16sgrh in your device and printers, and also you can not see it in the DCS, just as its disconnected.
SO at this point all continue OK.
What you need to do, its really easy, open your DCS and configure it, with the Dx buttons do you have in the R3L, and also, configure in the RS_HID_DEV_TOOL the 8 slots at your convenience, for every flight necessity, use a hard configuration for precision flight, and soft for easy flight, as I told you, when we were connected. Take the real advantage of the R3L with the F16SGRH, do you have 8 different Flight control, in your hand, and you can select what you need in every moment, with your thumb finger.
So at this point, you only need configure your DCS and your R3L, for this you can use the DCS doc and our documentation for the R3L.
About How its your grip at this moment, as you can see, the Grip its trying to link with your computer, but you following my suggest, dont let connect, because you want have the most simple scenario, What you need to do to connect it, follow the Documentation, and do the same we do several times together, when I got the control of your computer. But I suggest, if configure the DCS DX inputs its a difficult task for you, its better you wait a few days, until the beta test team, finish the testing, and we release the new software, And I suggest you use only the R3L with the F16SGRH inside.
About foxy and the old cougar, I must sure you, configure the Direct X buttons in the DCS its a more simple task, than programming the old cougar. and configure the R3L its more simple than recalibrate the old cougar, But you need read the documentation. once you read and test the system you really understand that its ABSOLUTELY EASY just as you get what you see. with no necessity of programming, or doing any script.
About the plug-in and reconnecting.
Here the point its, that TM put this connector in the first beginning and the only way to let you have compatibility with your old Cougar and the new Warthog it use the same connector, really we dont like this connector, but the other choice, its dont let you use the cougar or warthog in the R3, and this its not what you really like, no? of course you can change grips as many time as you like, and here I really connect grips several times every day, but at home, I had installed my F16SGRh and I dont change it, so at home, its really difficult I will broken the connector, and here in the company, with the testing, of course I take care, and I have not broken any ever. Can be broken, of course, but, the other way its incompatibility
Please, Mark, take a look to the documentation, and please, forgot the idea about use the system its a difficult task, its absolutely easy, and once you do your first configuration, you will be pride and will enjoy it.
And hope in a few days release the new software, and this will let you use near to whole system through the R3L.
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markturner
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Re: using cougar stick with R3
Hi Manuel, I just emailed you with some pictures...
In reply, firstly you suggest to remove the F-16 grip as a device. I cant do this as its not shown as a device anywhere, only the R3 shows in my devices, see picture I sent you.
Then you say, follow the procedure in the manual and we tried together.... I cant do this, as the device is not detected when I plug it in ? When I press "add device", it does not find it. When I plug it directly into the R3, it does not show up in DCS , so I cant directly assign any button functions within DCS. Neither does the cougar grip I tried instead......
A possible issue here is my level of understanding of the basics of DX assignments and programming.....basically, its very limited and while I am sure we could get there eventually, the language barrier makes this tricky. Ideally, I need to be able to speak with someone in English who can give me a simple tutorial on the basics, so I understand the whole picture. I feel a little like someone with a jigsaw with several important pieces missing, the whole picture is difficult to see.....Who that person might be and how I contact them...I don't know.....It probably sounds easy to you as its what you do for a job. I will read the documentation again, but of course, without understanding exactly how the DX and keystrokes work, then it does not all make sense to me. This hardware is great, but does assume a degree of familiarity and understanding of certain things that many end users do not necessarily have. I am not stupid, I have built my own PC's, and have a good working knowledge of how they work. But delve deeper into the world of scripts, .LAU files and programming and I am rapidly out of my depth...it is very difficult learning when you cant ask questions of things and get them answered so you can move to the next step. You then have to rely on kind people on forums helping you and typing stuff out is time consuming and not ideal....
I must say, getting hardware to work properly seems an insurmountable problem....I recently spent £300 on a touchscreen so I could run Helios for some of the switches etc in DCS, but guess what, I cant get my monitors configured to output the gauges to the touchscreen.....and no one has helped me, despite many forum requests on DCS....so it just sits here doing nothing...much like my expensive grip......I would gladly pay someone good money to come around to my house and set all this stuff up......but that's not going to happen.....
Please forgive my frustration, I just want to get my kit working and spend some time flying jets in the simulator......
kind regards, mark
In reply, firstly you suggest to remove the F-16 grip as a device. I cant do this as its not shown as a device anywhere, only the R3 shows in my devices, see picture I sent you.
Then you say, follow the procedure in the manual and we tried together.... I cant do this, as the device is not detected when I plug it in ? When I press "add device", it does not find it. When I plug it directly into the R3, it does not show up in DCS , so I cant directly assign any button functions within DCS. Neither does the cougar grip I tried instead......
A possible issue here is my level of understanding of the basics of DX assignments and programming.....basically, its very limited and while I am sure we could get there eventually, the language barrier makes this tricky. Ideally, I need to be able to speak with someone in English who can give me a simple tutorial on the basics, so I understand the whole picture. I feel a little like someone with a jigsaw with several important pieces missing, the whole picture is difficult to see.....Who that person might be and how I contact them...I don't know.....It probably sounds easy to you as its what you do for a job. I will read the documentation again, but of course, without understanding exactly how the DX and keystrokes work, then it does not all make sense to me. This hardware is great, but does assume a degree of familiarity and understanding of certain things that many end users do not necessarily have. I am not stupid, I have built my own PC's, and have a good working knowledge of how they work. But delve deeper into the world of scripts, .LAU files and programming and I am rapidly out of my depth...it is very difficult learning when you cant ask questions of things and get them answered so you can move to the next step. You then have to rely on kind people on forums helping you and typing stuff out is time consuming and not ideal....
I must say, getting hardware to work properly seems an insurmountable problem....I recently spent £300 on a touchscreen so I could run Helios for some of the switches etc in DCS, but guess what, I cant get my monitors configured to output the gauges to the touchscreen.....and no one has helped me, despite many forum requests on DCS....so it just sits here doing nothing...much like my expensive grip......I would gladly pay someone good money to come around to my house and set all this stuff up......but that's not going to happen.....
Please forgive my frustration, I just want to get my kit working and spend some time flying jets in the simulator......
kind regards, mark
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Dragon
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Re: using cougar stick with R3
Don’t worry, Mark, you are absolutely, right, If I would lift near you, I would go to your home and in a coplesof hoursyou would be configuring the whole system
Unfortunately I can not go to your home, but can help you sure
Next week we will meet and hope you got the whole picture
We will focus in the new software, just as we have all together in a simple windows
Kind regards
Unfortunately I can not go to your home, but can help you sure
Next week we will meet and hope you got the whole picture
We will focus in the new software, just as we have all together in a simple windows
Kind regards
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markturner
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Re: using cougar stick with R3
Thanks Manuel....
Can someone just refresh my memory...whats the quick and simple way to ascertain which of the 2 device columns that show within DCS for the R3L is the one for axes and which for programming buttons?
Also, now I have 3 grips that I can choose to use on the R3L base. However, none of them seem to be detected withing DCS to assign buttons to? Why is this? I have Th F-16 grip, Cougar grip and the new TM F-18 grip. With all of them, plugged into the R3, no button presses are detected within DCS when I try and assign functions.....
Thanks
Can someone just refresh my memory...whats the quick and simple way to ascertain which of the 2 device columns that show within DCS for the R3L is the one for axes and which for programming buttons?
Also, now I have 3 grips that I can choose to use on the R3L base. However, none of them seem to be detected withing DCS to assign buttons to? Why is this? I have Th F-16 grip, Cougar grip and the new TM F-18 grip. With all of them, plugged into the R3, no button presses are detected within DCS when I try and assign functions.....
Thanks
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Supmua
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Re: using cougar stick with R3
Mark,markturner wrote:Thanks Manuel....
Can someone just refresh my memory...whats the quick and simple way to ascertain which of the 2 device columns that show within DCS for the R3L is the one for axes and which for programming buttons?
Also, now I have 3 grips that I can choose to use on the R3L base. However, none of them seem to be detected withing DCS to assign buttons to? Why is this? I have Th F-16 grip, Cougar grip and the new TM F-18 grip. With all of them, plugged into the R3, no button presses are detected within DCS when I try and assign functions.....
Thanks
The way R3L works in DCS is something in lieu of 32 DX inputs per column (which means button 0 to 31), and that's why you see two R3L devices there (same as in Windows joy.cpl) since R3L supports 64 DX inputs per layer. Input 32-63 from R3L will be input 0-31 in the *second* R3L device in DCS setting. Since these virtual devices have the exact same names you will have to test it by assigning buttons and see which column you should use. If you have the F-16 grip, the TMS center and DMS center buttons will be on device 2, most of the regular buttons will be on device 1. Think of it as one joystick that splits into two virtual devices when used with DCS.
I can probably help you get the F-16 grip to work with R3L, but first you need to remember a few things.
-For firmware update, the grip has to be in BOOTLOADER mode in bluetooth setting (Trigger2 + TMS center + DMS center to initiate).
-For play mode, the grip has to be in HOME mode in bluetooth setting (DMS center + TMS center to initiate).
-Every time you want to switch between BOOTLOADER and HOME mode, you must remove the previous one from bluetooth connection first.
-To make all this happen you need a stable bluetooth connection, meaning you need to have the right bluetooth dongle! From my personal testing, only one BT dongle works reliably for me {CSR 4.0).
To make sure you clear out BOOTLOADER or HOME devices from previous binding, go to DEVICE MANAGER and click on the arrowhead next to Bluetooth. Then View menu and choose Show Hidden Devices, and delete any RS-F16-SGR HOME or BOOTLOADER and also any greyed out items that you see. Afterward you can start connection process again, but keep in mind that this will not work unless you have the right bluetooth dongle that can maintain stable connection.
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markturner
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Re: using cougar stick with R3
Hi Supmua, thanks, that's useful. re the columns, it would be too easy to think that DCS would have the first column as inputs 1-32 and the second column as 32-64.....Does DCS place the columns randomly, or does it put it as would be logical, 1-32 first, IE on the left and the next 32-64, to the right of the first one? Which number DX input are the axes? As Manuel said these go in one column and the button assignments in the other one...
For now, I am not using my F-16 grip, as I cant get it to work. Hopefully Manuel can help, we plan a screen share shortly.
So currently I have plugged in my new TM F-18 grip to my old warthog joystick base. Long term, when I get the kit operational, I plan to use the F-16 grip on the R3L base, to fly BMS and the F-16 in DCS.( As that's how it is in the real jet, force sensing) I will use the moving stick and F-18 grip for the Hornet in DCS. Again, for closeness to reality and also, this makes it easier with programming buttons etc, as having to replica grips for each jet, I can assign functions exactly as in reality.
I have an old cougar which I plan to update with the TUSBA and hall sensor kit, to use as throttle when flying the F-16.
While the additional programming functionality of the F-16 grip is obviously cool, to be honest, I would like to use it simply as it functions in the real jet, but with the switchable sensitivity options for refueling etc. This will hopefully also make life simpler.
In reply to the bluetooth advice - There were some hidden greyed out items which I deleted. There was nothing described as RS F-16 SGR Home or Bootloader.........I now have 4 items listed, they are:
Bluetooth device (RFCOMM Protocol TDI)
Generic Bluetooth Radio
Microsoft Bluetooth Enumerator
Microsoft Bluetooth LE Enumerator
Is this correct?
In devices, I dont have a Home or bootloader showing and if I plug the grip in, it does not show up if you press add device.......
What is the process to remove the previous bluetooth connection you refer to? This is not mentioned in the manual..... Nor anything about switching between bluetooth modes.
Finally, I installed the new firmware, do i understand correctly that with this, bluetooth is now no longer needed ? In theory, if I plug my grip into the R3 base, it should work like a standard warthog grip, yes? If thats so, then mine does not. If I try and assign buttons to the F-16 grip within DCS, nothing happens, the button presses on the grip are not detected.
For now, I am not using my F-16 grip, as I cant get it to work. Hopefully Manuel can help, we plan a screen share shortly.
So currently I have plugged in my new TM F-18 grip to my old warthog joystick base. Long term, when I get the kit operational, I plan to use the F-16 grip on the R3L base, to fly BMS and the F-16 in DCS.( As that's how it is in the real jet, force sensing) I will use the moving stick and F-18 grip for the Hornet in DCS. Again, for closeness to reality and also, this makes it easier with programming buttons etc, as having to replica grips for each jet, I can assign functions exactly as in reality.
I have an old cougar which I plan to update with the TUSBA and hall sensor kit, to use as throttle when flying the F-16.
While the additional programming functionality of the F-16 grip is obviously cool, to be honest, I would like to use it simply as it functions in the real jet, but with the switchable sensitivity options for refueling etc. This will hopefully also make life simpler.
In reply to the bluetooth advice - There were some hidden greyed out items which I deleted. There was nothing described as RS F-16 SGR Home or Bootloader.........I now have 4 items listed, they are:
Bluetooth device (RFCOMM Protocol TDI)
Generic Bluetooth Radio
Microsoft Bluetooth Enumerator
Microsoft Bluetooth LE Enumerator
Is this correct?
In devices, I dont have a Home or bootloader showing and if I plug the grip in, it does not show up if you press add device.......
What is the process to remove the previous bluetooth connection you refer to? This is not mentioned in the manual..... Nor anything about switching between bluetooth modes.
Finally, I installed the new firmware, do i understand correctly that with this, bluetooth is now no longer needed ? In theory, if I plug my grip into the R3 base, it should work like a standard warthog grip, yes? If thats so, then mine does not. If I try and assign buttons to the F-16 grip within DCS, nothing happens, the button presses on the grip are not detected.
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Dragon
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Re: using cougar stick with R3
HI MIke.
Please, check, in your FSSB R3 have the DX ON, you can do it, in the FSSB R3 page, chenk the DX are on, inthe slot you are working.
Thanks.
Please, check, in your FSSB R3 have the DX ON, you can do it, in the FSSB R3 page, chenk the DX are on, inthe slot you are working.
Thanks.